Moss Motors, Ltd

I just purchased my first MG today, a '78 MGB, and knowing it needs some work. I've previously only owned domestic hotrods, so this is truly a foreigner! I've checked the engine oil, and under the hood, and found the water pump to be frozen, but all else looks ok. The motor turns over fine, but there isn't spark to the plugs. I plan to check the coil, and points tomorrow, but just thought someone might know of something else I should check as well.

Chuck  

Welcome to the world of MGs!  These are fun little cars, even if hopelessly out-of-date and barely able to keep up with the mildest of the compact sedans out there today.  There's a lot of MG experts here on-line and the Moss distributor staff are extremely knowledgable and helpful in working thru restorations or problems.

Ignition systems - as you know, lots to fail here, and mostly likely a poor electrical connection.  Wires and unmolested wiring harnesses usually don't fail over time, but the connectors are the weak point in British cars.  Corrosion and loose fittings are very common in the "B".  A shop manual's electrical diagrams and volt meter are essential tools on these cars!

Here's a link to the Moss TV web site on how to trouble-shoot the ignition system:  http://www.mossmotors.com/sitegraphics/pages/mosstv/mosstv_electrical.html

Good luck and enjoy the car!

I've owned several MGB's over the years. 1st thing a '78 shouldn't have points.If it does,someone has changed the distributor.It wouldn't be the first time. Secondly if it is the original distributor the aftermarket ( Moss, Victoria British, etc.) can supply you with a great aftermarket electronic ignition very reasonable and they are simple to install.You will be much happier with one of these systems. They are much more reliable.They come w/instructions that are very easy to follow. It is important on these vehicles to get a distributor # off your present distributor as it could have been changed in the past and you never know what you will find in a MGB as they are totally interchangable from the earliest to the latest models.That's why I said the car could have points, but I doubt it. I definately would'nt recommend fixing with the factory components. 1st thing would be to take a test light or voltmeter and see if you have power at the coil w/the key on.These cars were noted for ignition failures w/late model electronic ignition systems.

Thank you for all the advice. It took me about 2 days, but changed the points that were melted, and the ignition relay, and starter relay. I found that the previous orner had used aftermarket relays, and hooked up some of the wires wrong. So I purchased the Lucas round cylinder relays, "I have spark". I purchased an aftermarket fuel pump, and cleaned the fuel lines, and got it started!!! Me and my neighbor, high fived... I think it's been a few years since this thing has been started, but it just purrrrred. So let it run for just a minute and noticed most of the guages don't work. So I shut it off. The oil pressure gauge was not moving which worried me the most. So I began by hooking up a manual gauge, which didn't have a reading either. I've changed the oil and filter with Casterol 20w 50. Also, replaced the spring in the oil release valve, and cheked to make sure the shim and all else was intact and ok. I started once again for a few seconds, and still no reading on the oil pressure, at all. The only thing I feel is left is the oil pump. So I guess the next step is to pull the pan and investigate the pump and gaskets.

Chuck  

It is highly unusual for an MGB oil pump to fail. Sure, they'll wear down and produce less than adequate flow, but zero pressure is not too likely. I have seen these engines put back together with the oil pump gasket placed improperly, such that the pump can't draw, and I have seen where some inner component which is supposed to hold oil has come loose (or was never tightened properly), allowing oil to pour freely back into the sump. Of course, there could be severe bearing problems, but I would think you'd have reported something other than a purrrrring engine, such as nasty knocking noises.

How long, more exactly, did you let it run altogether? When we have built an engine, we remove the spark plugs and turn the engine on the starter untill we show a reading on the oil pressure gauge. This sometimes takes as long as a couple of minutes of intermittent cranking. I will assume this isn't your problem, since you say you let it run for a bit, which should indeed pressure things up.

Also, consider that the manual gauge you used to prove things out may be defective. We usually use a backup to prove out the alternate. I know this sounds like a lot of bother, but so is dropping the sump and oil pump.

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Motorbill
From Lola to Land Rover, If it's British and has wheels, it's likely I've bloodied me knuckles thereupon

Thanks!

I'll take the plugs out and try turning it over for a bit. I really do hate to take the oil pan off, but mostly out of options. It has 80k miles on the odometer, so I'm guessing at some point it may have been into. Also, I find myself checking behind the previous owner. It seems there are a lot of issues I've already corrected. The crankcase vent was even shut off at the front of the motor, with a small piece of rubber hose, and a bolt... I can't figure that one out, and sure hope it didn't damage anything. Not sure how long it ran that way. I'll report my findings in a few days.

Chuck 

 

Well, it took some time, but finally got the oil pan off, and found the problem. While under the car I noticed that the pan had come in contact with something, but it didn't look that bad. The pan was just dented in slightly. After taking the pan off, I found the strainer was laying in the bottom, and had broken off from the pump. It looks like a fresh break too. Apparently, whatever the pan came in contact with was a much harder hit then I thought. So now it's back to getting a pump, and reassemble. I've probably taken apart more then needed, but found I had to disconnect the motor mounts and lift the motor a couple of inches just to get to the bolts in front of the pan. The motor mounts look like the rubber is pulling away from the brackets, so I may as well replace them also. I heard MG's a famous for oil pan leaks, so I was thinking of using a product called Right Stuff with the gasket. Any thoughts?

I used Hylomar for the pan gasket, but I have heard good things about Right Stuff.

Also, before you put that pan back on, make sure that it is perfectly flat!

Turn it over on a flat surface (I use my cast iron table-saw bed), with a flashlight in there and see if any light sneaks out. You can also use a piece of paper as a feeler gauge to go around the mounting lip. When you press down on the thing, there should be absolutely no rocking anywhere.

That gasket is very thin so take the time to straighten the mounting lip. Don't rely on the bonding agents to make up for big gaps.

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On their death bed, nobody ever said, "Gee I wish I'd spent more time at work!"

'68 Sprite 1275
'76 Midget 1500

ok, Thanks. I cleaned the pan and flatened out the bottom that was dented in with a rubber hammer. It's the first I've seen oil pressure, which is about 70 at an idle.  The motor sits a lot higher with the new motor mounts in place. They wern't too bad to install, with the exception of the one nut on the driver side where the mount attaches to the frame. Any advice on getting that on? The steering shaft goes right thru the frame, and it seems impossible to screw the nut on without taking out the steering shaft. I've taken a few days off from working on it until my hands heal from all the work I've done on it.... But overall pretty happy with what's been accomlplished. I also really do appreciate all the advice and the confidence y'all are giving me.

Chuck

70lbs at idle is G-R-E-A-T!!! Maybe even too much! Keep an eye on it.

I can't advise you on that mount (I'm a Spridget guy), but fear not, someone else will be chiming in soon.

Cheers!

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On their death bed, nobody ever said, "Gee I wish I'd spent more time at work!"

'68 Sprite 1275
'76 Midget 1500