Moss Motors, Ltd

I just inherited an MGA 1500 rodster, 1956 (I think).  No title, the ID plate is rusted to almost dust and I can decifer 5 numbers off of it.  This car is a total BASKET CASE.  All the parts seem to be there but I don't know what I am looking for.  I want to do a total frame off restoration of this vehicle but I have never even driven a European car before, Amerian all the way.  I inherited this car from a very dear family friend after his death so I have no choice but to make this car absolutely beautiful again.  I have already restored a 1967 Mercury Cougar, 1974 Chevy Truck and a frame off on an 1985 Toyota Pick-up so my mechanical skills are very compitent with a complete shop.  I am not going to even start on it until a get the proper books in my hands that begin with dis-assembly.

I am looking for any advice I can get on everything.  Which books to aquire, which parts suppliers, which clubs to join?  Should I run away screaming and never look back?

Any advice anyone can give me on any aspect of this car or restoration would be greatly appreciated.

My friend purchased this car about 1978 and I fell in love with it the first time I saw it.  It was driven in the Ft. Worth, TX area for about 15 years with very little care and maintenance.  It then set parked in a back yard for at least 10 years and 3 days ago I trailered it home to the Oklahoma City area.

I'm ready to spend the next 2-5 years building a head turner.    P.S. I just found out it is a bonnett.

Charles, welcome to the MGA world. You definitely have a project ahead of you. I would suggest buying a couple of books that will help as well as taking a long look through the Eclectic Motorworks web site. http://www.eclecticmotorworks.com/  Carl and his crew do fantastic restoration work on MGAs and have kindly documented in all with photos for the rest of us to follow. The books are: Original MGA by Andres Clausager, and The MGA Restoration Guide by Malcom Green. A service manual such as the original factory book or a Haynes will also be helpful. Sources for MGA parts include our hosts here Moss Motors as well as many others both here and in Britian. The mechanical bits are fairly simple and straight forward, it's the body restoration that is so daunting to many people, but quite doable at home if you follow Carls guide and take your time. Another source for great information on the MGA is Barney Gaylord's web site. http://mgaguru.com/mgtech/index2.htm  Barney has about the most complete source of information on all aspects of MGA restoration and maintenance assembled in one place.

There are also other bulletin boards and forums with great support offered there as well. Try the "MG Experience" MGA board or the "British Car Forum".

 

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'73 Midget (V6)
'59 MGA (I6) under construction
'73 Lotus Europa

"There is a fine line between a hobby and mental illness"

Charles,

MGAs are my favorite car, bar none. And, I'm always pleased by the prospect of one of these gems being resurrected. I've been working on and restoring them for over forty years, and I consider myself as much of an authority on their proper care and feeding as anyone mentioned so far. I realize that may sound a tad boastful, but the fact is I really know these cars. On this forum you can get just about all the information and moral support you'll ever need. I do, of course, urge you to read everything you can get your hands on and check out all the other sources as well. Digest it all  before embarking on this journey. You will likely get conflicting advice. Always ask questions in that instance, for it is you and you alone who will live with the results of your choices.

But the reason I have responded to your post has nothing to do with the technicalities of the work, or to advise you on how you should go about it. I sense that you feel some emotional pressure to accomplish this task in deference to your lost friend. I too inherited an automobile from a friend when he passed away, and it has been sitting at my house for quite some time. The emotional tug is tough, and for some time I told myself I would get to work on it. I know you said you admired the car when you saw it, but ask yourself if this is a project you would take on in other circumstances. If, after reflection, you doubt it then consider making a different choice.

I'm in the restoration business (specifically British cars) and over the years I've worked for folks who've taken on a restoration in memoriam. Now I know it's not the same thing, because you'd be doing the work yourself and because you have an understanding of things automotive. But the fact is, in some of these cases the devotion wears off and their lives go on. Like all humans, they change. Ask yourself if you might change. I know I have.

You've indicated that you've never done anything with this kind of car before. They are different. Some things will seem inexplicable and frustrating. The technology is automotive ancient history. You must avoid being judgemental, and must realize that the best result will not give performance on a par with any of the other cars you have mentioned. There are improvements and upgrades which can make the car more enjoyable, in spite of what the Originality Police will say, and I can walk you through them if you like. If absolute originality is you goal, that's also admirable. It's expensive though.

I advise you to sit with current catalogs for a long time and list everthing you could need. Does the car have wire wheels? Count on all new hubs, wheels, tubes, rim bands, and tires. Add that up. Wow... I'm certainly not trying to qualify you financially. That's your business. I'm just advising you to be prepared. This next part is tough to say, and I hope you'll take it in the understanding spirit it is offered.

As I said at the outset, I love these cars. I think they're the best thing ever to come out of MG Abingdon on Thames. I would love to see yours proudly driving down the road once again. Just be sure you'll be doing it for yourself, and not your departed friend who is at peace. I'm sure he doesn't want to see you with an emotional albatross around your neck. If after reflection you decide to go for it, you'll find a great community of enthusiasts who are genuinely nice folks willing to lend more help than you ever would have imagined. Good luck.

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Motorbill
From Lola to Land Rover, If it's British and has wheels, it's likely I've bloodied me knuckles thereupon

Hi Charles

   I would think long and hard before restoring a basket case unless it was a rare car or it has an important historical provenance. I am about 2/3rds of the way through a full body off complete nut and bolt restoration of a 1958 MGA coupe. It was faily good car to start with and even though I am doing most of the work myself I probably will be out of pocket $15,000 + the initial cost of the car by the time I turn the key and drive it. It may be better to find a good starter car and use the basket case for spares. I am not trying to rain on your parade but you will put more into the car than its final value. I have found from experience ( 1964 XKE ) that it can cease to be fun and become an exercise in frustration and heart ache and a savagly depleted bank account. Which ever way you go good luck and happy motoring.

 

Mark

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1958 MGA coupe ( under restoration
1972 MGB GT
1995 Ford Bronco
2004 Pontiac GTO

Charles, It is an admirable endeavor upon which you embark. Since you've restored cars in the past, you know basically what to expect.

It is true that the time and money that you put into this car will not be worth it if selling is your goal, but I don't get the sense that you want to sell. You feel a mission, and in that mission is a connection to your friend. Let that be your inspiration when your knuckles are bloodied and you back is contorting (common issues while working on these tea burners). 

You have come to the right place. I was never a gear-head in high school, and have merely aspired to changing oil and breaks in my adult life, until...I have recently restored a tea burner for myself. My first car was a 68 Austin Healey Sprite and my mid-life crisis mandated another.

As my dad always told me, "you only need 3 things to succeed at any job: tools, common sense, and self confidence". It sounds like you already have the tools and common sense, this forum will help you with the self confidence just as it did for me.

motorbill, Bill Young, Ed Holland, Poolboy, Zack77, and about a dozen more....there are so many competent players here, don't get me started! This is a GREAT place to be for info, camaraderie and commiseration.

3 years ago, I was where you are right now. Long story short, these guys helped me, a mere electronics instructor, by stepping me through each step of my restoration to the point where my Austin Healey is now my daily driver and head turner!

The previous posts to this are all right-on. I'm just adding my 2 cents as a witness to the expertise of the advisers on this forum.

God speed man, keep a stiff upper lip, and RESTORE THAT MGA!!!

 

 

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On their death bed, nobody ever said, "Gee I wish I'd spent more time at work!"

'68 Sprite 1275
'76 Midget 1500

Bill Young, motorbill66, kiwimark, davey,

 I am truly overwhelmed by all of your kind words and encouragement.  Your words of caution are as greatly appreciated as you words of encouragement.  I have absolutey found a gold mine in this forum.  I can't thank all of you enough for your advice and direction.  I really love this car and one of my life long best friends in a Mini Cooper owner who is giving me great motivation.  This is definately going to be a labor of love.  I enjoy bringing old cars back to life and there is nothing like a good challenge.  I will purchase all the books recommended and start with lots of research.

  I am very lucky to have many resourses available.  My brother-in-law is a 25 year SAE mechanic who specializes in building race cars (sprint cars).  A very good friend of mine has an industrial soda blaster that he specializes in stripping VW bugs so I'll throw an MGA in there for him.  I painted jets for the U.S. Air Force for 10 years and many of my co-worker/friends are from the automotive paint & body business who own private shops. A 20 year friend of mine has a walk-in size powder coating booth at my disposal.

Needless to say I am going to call in every favor ever owed to me and some.  All of your guys are going to learn to hate me over the next few years because of me completely draining your brains for all the advice I can get.

Thank you all again so much for all your kind words and encouagement.

By the way, I also enherited two 1969 MGBGT's from the same friend.  They are both in pretty good shape but not drivable.  They are next in line if I can take it or I may sell them both to help fund the A model, yet to be determined.

Charles,

Cool! Let's get started!

Motorbill

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Motorbill
From Lola to Land Rover, If it's British and has wheels, it's likely I've bloodied me knuckles thereupon

Hi Charles

   sorry if I sounded a bit negative in my post. I have seen to many people get in over their heads on this sort of project. You obviously have the experience and the resourses to take this on so I say go for it. If I can pass on anything I have picked up during my rebuild please feel free to e-mail me and I will help if I can. I have modified my A to make it a bit more drivable in modern day traffic by fitting a high comp MGB 5 main engine, moss 5 speed box and a 3.9 rear end. This should allow it to scoot along quite well in SoCal's maniacal freeway traffic.

 

Mark

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1958 MGA coupe ( under restoration
1972 MGB GT
1995 Ford Bronco
2004 Pontiac GTO

Charles,

Having done a few restorations on mainly English cars, I'll share with you a couple of thoughts that I would do to begin your project. One of the most important is you will never get the money you spend on the restoration back. So you must do it in a timely manor being dictated by your funds. Do the research in various books you will have to buy and get online with a few of the many blogs and forums that appeal to you. Get a decent digital camera and take pictures before and after you remove any part or assembly. Get zip lock freezer type of bags and put all pieces smaller than a bread box in the bags that you have previously labeled. Keep a log on what you have done, a word perfect document or something like it. Get quotes from the body and upholstery people you might use. Don't be in a hurry it can take years to do this kind of work. I also recommend you have an inside dry place to do the work so it can be left undisturbed if you have to leave it for birthdays, anniversaries, kids and etc. Join the local NAMGAR chapter in your area and other British car clubs, members are a plethera of info. Try and get a buddy to help you, yes it can be your wife or girl friend. Last but not least, if you get stressed or overwhelmed by the amount of time or work, leave it for a while, it'll be there when you get back to it.  Hope this get's you started.

Tucker

 

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Tucker J. Madawick

Mark,

Your words were not discouraging or negative at all.  I appreciate your insight and honesty. 

I am not planning on doing a factory exact rebuild.  I would like to moderize some things and possibly increase performance.  I am not even against installing an American or Japanese drive train (stop throwing rocks).  On the surface I want the car to look absolutey original but I am totally open for drivetrain, suspension, electrical, fuel, etc... modifications or changes.

The car came with the complete 1500 drivetrain and I also received 1600 and 1800 motors as extras.  I have been offered a 4.3 liter V6 Chevy with trans for it.  But obviously the rebuild is way down the road.  I hope to start the rebuild process in no more than one year.

Is there anything specific you can recommend or suggest for the dis-assembly?  I am planning to bag and tag everything and keep written records with photos.  Is there anything to watch out for or dos &  don't I should be aware of?

I cannot express how much I appreciate your advice and shared knowledge.

Charles

Tucker,

I appreciate your excellent advice.  I have learned the hard way from previous restorations to bag & tag everything.  I have a 30 X 40 shop that I do all my work in (my wife accuses me of living in) so that is a huge benefit.  I am starting the dis-assembly immediately so I will be constantly asking for advice and direction.

Thanks for you help and encouragement.

 

DOES ANYONE KNOW OF AN MG CLUB AROUND OKLAHOMA CITY OR VICINTIY.  I haven't been able to find any closer than Texas or Kansas.

Hi Charles

  The thing I found most useful was to place parts in numbered bags and boxes and record them in excel. Listing also wether to refubish or replace and moss part no, price etc. This gives you a spread sheet with all the info at your finger tips. It makes it a cinch to find stuff straight away and is a great help formulating your plan of attack for the restoration. Also with the deconstruction treat each part as irreplacable until you have the new piece in your hand. You never know what will become unavailable over time.

 

Mark

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1958 MGA coupe ( under restoration
1972 MGB GT
1995 Ford Bronco
2004 Pontiac GTO

Hi Charles,

First join NAMGAR!  Secondly, be prepared to spend 5 years on the project. Get catalogs from Brown & Gammons, Ltd. as well as Scarborough Faire and Victoria British.  Todd Clarke of Clarke Spares & Restorations is also a source of fine parts and information. I have gone both a '59 MGA 1600 and a 1250 TF and both cars took five years each.

 

David

P.S.--From David

Very important!

Don't have the trunk lid, doors and hood soda blasted.  The chances are that the blaster will push the aluminium skin into the steel sub-structure of the panels.

MGAdavid,

Thanks for the excellent advice on not soda blasting the aluminum, that is exactly what I was going to do.  Do you recommend chemical stripping?  And if so, over the counter stripper or a commercial dip vat stripper service?

Any other recommedations you have would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks to everyone for all the outstanding advice.  I am applying it all and I would love alot more advice of any kind.

I am in the dis-assembly process now so any guidance or warnings would be put to use.

Thanks again

Charles